Final Narrative Statement

This has been raised in a recent order from the court.

Quote

The time for the husband to serve and file his final narrative statement shall be extended to 4pm 15.8.23 and shall detail in bullet point form the issues he intends to raise at final hearing and his evidence upon them as well as any claim for spousal maintenance.

The time for the wife to serve and file her final narrative statement is extended to 4pm
29.8.23 detailing in bullet point form the issues she intends to raise at final hearing and her
evidence upon them

I am not concerned with the spousal maintenance element as I am hoping for a clean break with no ongoing obligations for either side. Or should I put in a claim in case she does?

It doesn't seem right that she gets 2 weeks to analyse my statement and form a response where I will have no idea of hers when writing mine. My wife has proven to be a lot more dramatic than myself. What do I do if her statement extends to details I felt where irrelevant nd therefore left out of mine? (which is highly likely)

What should be in my final narrative statement? Is there anywhere I can find an example?

Is it relevant to include things like the cost of the home rights notice which has been registered for 3 years and cost between £20-£30k?
She is likely to raise the issue of domestic violence, which is (technically) not relevant to a needs based argument. I would be inclined to leave it out, but i'm willing to bet they will bring it up. In reality, I have several hours of video footage where my wife would enter my office and attack me while I was trying to work. Do I include these attacks in some sort of chronology? Do I put the videos on a memory stick? or otherwise send them to court?

My wife is claiming she is unable to work due to depression and anxiety....caused by the abuse she (lies about) says I did. I have an audio recording of her refusing to allow me to watch TV one morning because she was "studying and applying for jobs. you want me to work don't you?" - The result of the ensuing argument was me dropping to the floor, being kicked in the back, left with a cracked rib, and driving myself to a&e.

How do I include that? It is relevant (IMHO) due to her claim she can or can't work.

Please, what goes into a final narrative statement?

I have a meeting with a charity, support through court, next week to help prepare the statement. They are staffed by volunteers, the purpose of the meeting to be to help me format the document for court.

But I don't know what documentation I should take and what to include in the statement.

What do I need to include in the statement?
How long is such a statement?
Do I include evidence?

Thanks

This hearing is to decide finances so domestic abuse would only be relevant if the nature of it was such that it impacted on a party's ability to work. I would therefore suggest it is not relevant to your case but as your ex-wife has a track record of being an abuser who - as is common among female abusers - seeks to use public institutions like the police and the courts against you then you are fairly certain to find she will claim she cannot work and blames you for it. Unfortunately, she can also point to the conviction secured against you.

I think your best bet is to outline in as much detail as space allows how there are no assets and demonstrate what your income is. You will be able to challenge anything your wife claims at a final hearing. I strongly recommend you find a way to pay a barrister to cross examine your wife. She is a nasty abuser and she needs to be cross examined by someone who really knows what they are doing.

Thank you. That is helpful, although I do still have the question of what to include in my Final Narrative Statement.

As for hiring a barrister, I simply do not possess the funds. I need to submit questions to the court, which are largely based around her claims that she is unable to work, however, has been recorded making statements regarding applying for work, and expressly stated she will be using funds to set up small business post divorce.

I do have a meeting in just under 2 weeks with a volunteer charity to set out the final narrative. However, this meeting is to prepare the document. The volunteer is unable to provide legal advice therefore I am not 100% certain of the documentation required for the meeting.

My understanding is that I start with what I would like to achieve....ie...50/50 division of assets, no maintenance, clean break, and work backwards as to why i think that is fair and just.

Yes, I fully expect the conviction to be raised, however I possess something which she does. not...video evidence of abuse (towards me)...The problem is that I need to submit my narrative one week before she does...so when she finalises hers, she will know what was in mine. I am not afforded the same benefit.

It will be cheaper to take a loan out for a direct access barrister than being lumbered paying maintenance to an abuser. She probably wants maintenance in order to be able to carry on controlling you and she's unlikely to give up until a barrister tears her a new one in court and exposes her for what she is.

Something doesn't look right in your original post. Why are you submitting first and the one claiming spousal maintenance? Normally in dispute resolution the person making the claim serves first, then the defence against the claim within two weeks and then the original claimant normally gets around 3 days to challenge the defence.

My personal experience of using a barrister (criminal case) is that all of this is just a game...win or lose, at least, the ones I spoke to...didn't really care...Everyone HATES to lose...but all of this is just a game. I still think, in my case (with a bit of research, I stand just as good a chance of a fair outcome without a barrister than with one..

..you see, regarding the assault conviction, I know the truth; I know it is wrong. And I showed my barrister considerable videos proving abuse "towards me"...yet (a qualified barrister) told me to walk away, So I don't trust them !

...forgetting that though...how do I legitimately bring my evidence of abuse, towards me, intro this to show how it would be unreasonable for a court to apply a maintenance order?

ConfusionReigns Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Something doesn't look right in your original
> post. Why are you submitting first and the one
> claiming spousal maintenance? Normally in dispute
> resolution the person making the claim serves
> first, then the defence against the claim within
> two weeks and then the original claimant normally
> gets around 3 days to challenge the defence.


Are you suggesting that I contact the court to confirm their expectation for the respondent to submit a final position statement prior to the applicant. I tend to agree that it does not feel right this way around. I would obviously prefer to have visibility of her position statement prior to submitting my own. Especially as I am Litigant in Person.

I'm not a qualified lawyer but I am studying the SQE at the moment (cheaper than paying a lawyer for my own case!) and I have studied dispute resolution and I know you can't submit a defence without there being a claim! It's very odd that your being asked to submit a claim for SM and she isn't.

Normally as I say it is claim, defence, claimant response to defence, hearing.

ConfusionReigns Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I'm not a qualified lawyer but I am studying the
> SQE at the moment (cheaper than paying a lawyer
> for my own case!) and I have studied dispute
> resolution and I know you can't submit a defence
> without there being a claim! It's very odd that
> your being asked to submit a claim for SM and she
> isn't.
>
> Normally as I say it is claim, defence, claimant
> response to defence, hearing.

Thank you. That would make more sense to me. I will send the court a letter on Monday clarifying their instructions. I want nothing from my wife, so it would seem logical that I get to see what it is she wants, and why....before I argue against it.

Generally speaking the rule is that narrative statements are exchanged by the same date. When a court departs from that and says that X should first file a narrative statement and at a later date Y should file theirs there is invariably a reason for doing that so I suspect there is some significant fact omitted from this post even if the original poster is not aware of that. This often happens with litigants in person.

I have contacted the court to raise the question of if this instruction was intentional. There has been no mention of any reason previously. I am still awaiting a response.

Does nobody really have an example of a final narrative statement? I just need to know what to put in the document?

Try something like this (I've worked on the assumption that there is no child maintenance in your case, but if there is state how much this changes net incomes after line 8):

1) I am Spartacus (sorry, couldn't resist!) in this matter, and I make this statement pursuant to the directions given by the Court to set out my case in respect of the criteria set down by Section 25 of the Matrimonial Causes Act 1973.

2) I will attempt to address each of the criteria in turn as set out in the Matrimonial Causes Act:
(a) The income, earning capacity, property and other financial resources which each of the parties to the marriage has or is likely to have in the foreseeable future, including in the case of earning capacity any increase in that capacity which it would in the opinion of the Court be reasonable to expect a party to the marriage to take steps to acquire.

3) State your employment and how much you earn gross.

4) State your net income and how much tax and national insurance you pay.

5) State any other sources of income and applicable taxes on this income.

6) "I am working full/part time, working **** hours and I would submit to this Court that I am maximising my earning capacity. I have no other sources of income."

7) State what your spouse's occupation is, what their skills are and what they could typically earn based on the hours they could work.

8) State what you expect your spouse's earning capacity to be and (briefly) mention any evidence this is based upon.

9) Provide an approximate value of the assets in dispute, your expected legal fees and thus the net assets after costs.

10) Explain where the capital came from (you, presumably, as your ex sounds like a vicious workshy abuser).

(b) The financial needs, obligations and responsibilities which each of the parties to the marriage has or is likely to have in the foreseeable future.

11) You could state here that there are no children of the marriage, so no reason why said lazy arse couldn't have worked all these years (or state number of children and ages if I have that wrong. If there are in fact children, add additional lines of where they reside and contact).

12) In respect of the housing needs of myself and [spouse] these are equal.

13) If there has been any agreement on housing in the past, say so here.

(c) The standard of living enjoyed by the family before the breakdown of the marriage.

14) We had a good standard of living during the marriage [if this is the case – detail any information relevant to the ongoing funding and difficulties/changes that may effect this]

(d) The age of each party to the marriage and the duration of the marriage

15) I was born on the *** and I am therefore ** years old. The Petitioner was born on the *** and is therefore ** years old.

16) The Petitioner and I were married on the *** and we separated in ***. This is therefore a short/medium/long length marriage of some 4/10/25 years [adjust as required]

(e) Any physical or mental disability of either of the parties to the marriage.

17) Both the Petitioner and I are in good health to the best of my knowledge and belief. [Include here comments that you reject your lazy arse ex's claims she cannot work]

18) [details of businesses, employment etc during the marriage and prior to the marriage]

19) State there are no future contributions to the family upon divorce (assuming no children)

20) Finally, I do not believe the issue of conduct is applicable in this matter and nor is there any entitlement that a party will lose the chance of acquiring as a result of the divorce that is relevant in any way (your ex is physically abusive, but unfortunately this clause would either require her to have beaten you so badly it reduced your ability to work or got into so much debt she bankrupted you).

21) I trust the matters set out herein are of assistance to this Honourable Court. I declare that to the best of my knowledge and belief the contents of this my statement are true and I understand that it may be placed before the court.

Signed

Dated

Thank you for that!

One of the questions that I have as to how to include the information is this.....following the affair, which I acknowledge to have regrettably occurred, I had made repeated attempts to carry out business from my home office. The intention was to continue to support my family. My wife repeatedly entered my office, attacked me, and proceeded to contact the police.

The point here being how would her behaviour towards preventing me from earning a living and providing for my family including herself be considered?

>>Does nobody really have an example of a final narrative statement? I just need to know what to put in the document?

There are as many 'examples' as there are individual cases. The factors a court has to take into account are set out in section 25 of the Matrimonial Causes Act and those factors are the paragraph headings. Not all the factors set out in section 25 will be relevant. And by that I mean 'legally relevant' not simply what you think is relevant. There is very likely a big difference. Others have already laboured the point that you need proper legal assistance. You have dismissed that advice so the buck will stop with you.

David Terry Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> >>Does nobody really have an example of a final
> narrative statement? I just need to know what to
> put in the document?
>
> There are as many 'examples' as there are
> individual cases. The factors a court has to take
> into account are set out in section 25 of the
> Matrimonial Causes Act and those factors are the
> paragraph headings. Not all the factors set out in
> section 25 will be relevant. And by that I mean
> 'legally relevant' not simply what you think is
> relevant. There is very likely a big difference.
> Others have already laboured the point that you
> need proper legal assistance. You have dismissed
> that advice so the buck will stop with you.


I haven't dismissed anything....I simply have not got the money! Hence I have no choice in the matter.

Ok. Please tell me this...

In reference to "conduct", by which I mean conduct which has had a direct financial impact, is this relevant...

After each "incident",whereby I was attacked (in my home office), generally arrested, taken into custody, kept away from my home for a period of time before an NFA decision was returned by CPS. This was a pattern.

I kept returning to the family home, because I had a home office setup, and was trying throughout everything to keep working and supporting the family financially. During the attacks my wife would often take my computer equipment, and render me unable to work.

Due to the arrests (referring to those which eventually resulted in No Further Action), I had periods where I simply could not turn up for work (online meetings) and could not provide an explanation (I was in custody). This led to termination from 4 jobs (Following a termination, I would secure another position during a "calm" phase).

Those actions, have had a direct and lasting impact on my earning potential and been a major contributing factor into the decline in our net worth.

Is that something to include within the final narrative for the court to consider?

Why was my post with an S25 template deleted?

post it again?

Wikivorce has a better template than mine (and much better, more contemporary advice than David too).

David Terry Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> >>Does nobody really have an example of a final
> narrative statement? I just need to know what to
> put in the document?
>
> There are as many 'examples' as there are
> individual cases. The factors a court has to take
> into account are set out in section 25 of the
> Matrimonial Causes Act and those factors are the
> paragraph headings. Not all the factors set out in
> section 25 will be relevant. And by that I mean
> 'legally relevant' not simply what you think is
> relevant. There is very likely a big difference.
> Others have already laboured the point that you
> need proper legal assistance. You have dismissed
> that advice so the buck will stop with you.


One of the aspects of your response here, Terry, that I absolutely disagree with is the "need" for "legal assistance"...such that it may suggest the need for the services of a "solicitor". One thing that I will note as a litigant in person is that a magistrate (in my experience) possesses an appreciation that some people need to present as LIP. They therefore offer a level of leniency to persons acting as LIP, that might not otherwise be afforded. In addition, a "solicitor". or "barrister" (again, this is just my experience), fails to possess a personal element towards winning the argument. To a solicitor, this is just a game; win or lose they get paid. There may be more ethical persons in the industry however the majority would suggest the same.

There are two observations to make on this:-

1. Yes, lawyers are not personally invested in the outcome. However, that is precisely the point. It is the fact that they are not personally invested that enables them to be objective and to give dispassionate advice. Nor are judges personally invested and for good reason. If they were that would result in injustice.

2. Yes, courts do offer 'leniency' to litigants in person. They are obliged to do so in the interests of justice. However, do not mistake leniency about procedure with leniency in outcome, The two are very different. Advocacy is a specialised skill. It takes skill to think on your feet and to read the judge in front of you rather than read a prepared speech. At a final hearing the hammer falls so if a litigant in person has failed to raise a point or produce a document then the buck stops with the LIP. There is nothing wrong with being a LIP and sometimes there is no choice but very few LIPs in person can match a trained advocate. Possibly with help an average motorist might be able to drive an F1 car but none will be able to drive faster than an F1 driver with a super licence.

Yes, quite correct. I did delete that post. There are all sorts of reasons why that type of advice is unacceptable unless, of course, a person believes that, say, 'Here's how to cheat HMRC without them finding out' is acceptable advice.

Well, I think there's quite a big difference actually between divorce tactics and cheating HMRC. Both are unethical but only one is a criminal offence. Which is what makes such tactics so effective in practice. Occasionally judges see through it but perusing through a lot of cases there are plenty of "drat, my hands are tied" moments from judges. I guess the trouble is judges think they're smart but they're not as clever as they think and they have to work with laws written by idiots anyway.

What most reasonable people consider unethical:
Making it possible to go after someone's inheritance, making it possible to go after someone's pre marital assets.

All possible only in England divorce law. The most stark case of legalized theft I have ever encountered.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/10/2023 11:44AM by Randomer4040.

What randomer4040 persistently fails to appreciate is that he has a choice whether he gets married or not. And if he does get married most people regard marriage as a partnership and the rules upon divorce are what that particular society decides they are. Islamic law discriminates against women in inheritance, divorce and upon the weight attached to their evidence. Very few people bleat about that - even though they may regard such rules as unjust. They don't do it because they know that the societies that operate those rules won't change them however much they disagree. There is a reason why English law treats inheritances, pre-marital assets and pre-nuptial agreements in the way it does. In appropriate cases it will give due weight to those factors but it will not do so in all cases if the result would be injustice. English law is flexible enough to deal with these situations in a way that the inflexible rules of civil law systems are not.

Now, please, before you continue to criticise a country of which you are not a national and where you do not choose to live just tell us in which utopian country you do live so that these criticisms can be a two way street.

As to confusionreigns what you call 'divorce tactics' was advice that would get any lawyer swiftly struck off as has been seen recently with the action taken against some immigration lawyers. Such advice can also on occasion lead to criminal prosecution depending upon its nature. As to whether judges are smart or not, they vary much like the rest of the population but since higher court judges tend to be appointed from among the most successful lawyers they are very unlikely to be intellectually challenged as anyone can see who goes to the trouble to reading High Court and Court of Appeal judgements. It may be worth mentioning that Trust Law is essentially a creation of judges over the centuries. That is precisely what civil law systems cannot do.

it is good that you yourself compare the English law to the islamic law:
It is arguably as extremely unfair just the other way around.
I seriously do not understand how a hard working wealthy person can get married to somone with much less wealth/income in England when the contract is so unbelievably unfair.

Otherwise I dont have a problem with England and I actually think like the English and I think that makes it a great country.

What I find frustrating is:

I agree with the divorce law in my country (which has a higher GDP per capita and much better life quality than England), however the English law might still bite me in the ass should I get married here and live here.
Even here the divorce law is not exactly in the men's favour, but compared to England it is fair. The fact that England does not "leave me alone" as it can be used as a top up jurisdiction is the disgrace.

It is also not utopia, but yeah the divorce law is fairer. I never suggested anywhere is utopia.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/10/2023 11:57AM by Randomer4040.

The fact is that you don't regard it as fair because you are looking at it subjectively. English courts don't look at things subjectively. They look at them objectively and they give reasons for their decisions. Consider the three following situations:-

1. You marry. You bring your £1.5 million into the marriage. Your wife brings nothing. No children. You do not mingle your £1.5 million in any way but keep it completely separate in an account in your sole name. After a year you get divorced. In such circumstances it is overwhelmingly likely that you would keep your £1.5 million and you each walk away with what you entered the marriage with.

2. You marry. You bring your £1.5 million into the marriage. Your wife brings nothing. No children. You use £1 million of your £1.5 million to buy a house in which you both live. You keep the remaining £0.5 million in an account in your sole name and do not mingle it in any way. After five years you get divorced. You may then walk away with £0.5 million but you will not walk away with the rest because it now represents the matrimonial home which is a joint asset. Your wife may get half of that joint asset.

3. You marry. You bring your £1.5 million into the marriage. Your wife brings nothing.Two children. Your wife gives up her job to look after the children. After 20 years you get divorced. If there are no other significant assets the whole of your £1.5 million will be required to meet the reasonable needs of your wife and children on the one hand and you on the other.

Now these three situations are just a sample of the infinite variety of circumstances that might arise but they are sufficient for the purposes of illustration. And the fact is that anyone who looks at it objectively will see that a rigid rule that would always require premarital assets to be ring fenced would result in injustice in the latter two situations. You obviously do not see it that way. You think that 'justice' requires that you always get your money back. The courts here don't see it that way and I suspect that anyone who looks at the above three situations objectively can see exactly why even if you can't.

I should say that there are all sorts of factors which can affect each of the situations above in all sorts of ways. For instance, one of you may develop some illness like motor neurone disease (or one of goodness knows how many thousands of other conditions), your wife may earn more than you, she may earn less, you may mingle some assets and not others, you may build up other assets during the marriage, you may not, there may or may not be children, one or more children may have special needs etc etc.

The point is, individual circumstances are infinitely variable and the courts are mindful of that. That is why they adopt a flexibility which you are not willing to permit them but most people can see the sense of it when it is explained to them.

You keep on saying it is "objectively" fair. Again lawyers all over the world seem to agree with me. Those are reasonable people in the EU/USA, I am not talking about the islamic world.

The whole point of house being a "joint asset", you take this as given. Economically it should make zero difference, I buy a house with my 1.5 M and because I bought a house I have to give half away and if I keep in my bank account I dont. Even if there is no career sacrfiice whatsoever and I buy a house wife gets half? why? it makes no sense at all.



3) It is quite unlikely that over 20 years there are no other assets when there are 1.5M to start with (investement growth alone), but in this unlikely case such is life. The courts in reasonble jurisdicitons and reasonable people simply see it this way:
the 1.5M were generated and earned before the marriage, they have absolutely nothing to do with the marriage, the day we get married we sort start a joint business and when it ends we all get 50% of that business. There is also spousal maintance in a case 3) that you describe. So a career that was built during marriage may benefit both, however the 1.5M that have nothing to do with the marriage can not be used as is clealy economically logical. I find it suprising that this is so hard to understand.